National Debt Solution Part 5, Talking in Church

Our Only National Debt Solution, Part 5, Step 2: Talking in Church

Saving America with a solution that must be acted upon within 6 weeks requires something like a news network. News media are able to verify and distribute information within hours of when they receive it. It would be a simple matter for politically aware members of any church, if they were allowed, to meet together to discuss the trustworthiness of news sources, and to make recommendations to the congregation about who to trust, and to agree on particularly urgent breaking news that should be brought to the attention of worshipers at their next service through announcements or bulletin inserts.

Many activists have struggled for the past 59 years to establish such networks. But they are very seldom allowed. Thus Christians are left on their own by their church to scrutinize information sources, which very few know how to do, or care to do, well. Their church leaves them uninformed, and indirectly assured that being informed is not central enough to the mission of “Church” – indeed,  not important enough – to even be allowed on church property.

Christians need information and vetting thorough enough to identify and retire baseless conspiracies and media liars, who both deceive members and draw their attention away from solid, substantiated, urgent information. But by pastoral decree the church body must remain uninformed, deceived, and comfortable remaining so. That is, they must keep Light seated in one corner and Darkness in the other,  so that Darkness may invade their own lives, not to mention their neighborhoods, workplaces, families, and communities, without fear of exposure – so that they may even vote for Darkness, safe from realizing what they are doing.

As long as churches won’t even listen to their own activists, who can inform them?

In order to proclaim the message of America’s judgment and America’s choice, we need churches willing to share the message of this one solution coming to them from outside their church. How can we expect any church, pastor, or board to give any attention to messages from outside when they won’t even listen to their own members?

If a church is not in the habit of trusting their own activists to inform them about what news is true and urgent, who else in the church will process the warning and call to action we send them? The pastor, already overwhelmed with preparing sermons and visiting people? The secretary who can’t act on anything controversial without the pastor’s approval?

So what we need is the hardest goal of all: complete freedom of speech, even in church, for church members.

This wouldn’t just save America from its debt. It would instantly push back Satan’s assaults on America over the past century back into Hell, and would cause revival to break out in every church that allows it. Well, actually “revival” has become a controversial word, meaning unpleasant things to some people. But see if this description of what would happen sounds like something you would like to see in your church:

1 Corinthians 14:24 and if all [the members of your church] may [build  up, correct, and comfort], and any one may come in, an unbeliever or [Biblically] unlearned, he is convicted  by all, he is discerned by all, 25  and so the secrets of his heart become manifest, and so having fallen upon his face, he will bow before God, declaring that God really is among you.(YLT)

(This passage is combined with verse 3. Verse 24 uses the word prophesying”, but verse 3 describes the  spect of “prophesying”, which is meant in the context of this chapter, as “edification, exhortation, and comfort”.)

Sermons by politically literate pastors are a light without which America could not have survived this long. But it is a flickering match compared with what we need in this late hour. This urgent information needs a wider distribution than an occasional sermon. Most pastors are not political experts anyway. It is hard to preach about something you little understand. Information must be allowed to be presented by the people who understand it, just as a piano must be allowed to be played by a piano player.

And even when the pastor is a political expert, and let’s say his expertise attracts 19 other political activists to his congregation, just him preaching about an issue, and not allowing anyone else to discuss it, would make only 5% of the church brain power on the issue available to the church.

Perhaps the biggest tool of Satan is the rationale for only allowing the pastor to speak: to avoid offense. To avoid controversy. To censor whatever someone might disagree with and not like to hear.

That rules out most of reality. It rules out much mention of sins which infect the congregation so much that half the congregation votes for government to promote them and punish obstruction of them.

It certainly rules out wide ranging group discussion where members are free to share all the things they believe. (Some of those monsters are really weird, so it is thought best to “let sleeping dogs lie.”)

But imagine the benefits of that much Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religious Expression! When sound information is presented, the whole body would benefit! Even when false doctrine is presented, everyone would benefit and no one would be harmed, because in a setting where correction is allowed, the scrutiny of the entire group would be far more likely to spot the subtlest errors and correct them than if the burden is left to one person. All would share in the mind-sharpening experience of discerning error and searching Scripture to learn how to persuasively and lovingly correct it. This experience of reasoning with people even when you disagree would prepare church members to witness to unbelievers. It would even heal marriages and solve child rearing problems by providing members the relationship skills needed to reason with their loved ones even when they disagree.

All this would result from allowing church members the experience of sharing all the things they really believe, in a spirit of willingness to be tested. It would give church members a lot more incentive to study their Bibles, if their ability to respond to friends at the next service required it.

Precisely this much freedom of speech is commanded by God.

*slide show *PDF *more theology

Doesn’t successful Christian fellowship require censorship of that kind of disruption?

Evidence that a topic, or presentation, or discussion, is true, verifiable, Biblical, important, and timely should be a defense against the charge that it is controversial.

America’s current church format, with popular music and a lecture, is so spiritually sterile that even atheists can follow it.  I would like to see atheists try to follow a Biblical meeting format, where error can be exposed to truth, by anybody, and where evidence is a defense against offensiveness! Atheism couldn’t survive! It survives in America today only because church policy is to not let Light follow it into our schools, courtrooms, or political debates.

Of course, it is nothing new to hear it said that “The Church”, usually meaning The Other Guy’s “church”, has forsaken God in some detail or other. Denominations are the consequence of such claims. Church leaders used to torture each other to death over controversies such as whether the “bread and wine” literally turns into Jesus’ body and blood. How to baptize, what day to worship, what doctrines to believe, are the stuff of church splits. To the extent God’s opinion of any of these disputes is clear, it is never unimportant. But many churches split over issues not at all clear, where it would have been a lot more appropriate, sensible, and Biblical to either discuss it a lot more, to clear up what is vague, or to discuss it a lot less, after it is clear that there are other issues about which God is much more clear, which would be more profitable to discuss.

1 Timothy 1:4. Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

Because of that long history of easy accusations over unresolvable “questions”, I sympathize with readers tempted to roll their eyes at yet one more “accusation”. I ask only that you be a “noble Berean”, Acts 17:10-11, and “search the Scriptures” before you dismiss the questions I raise as unresolvable. Determine by Scripture whether rejection of this warning is really because the Bible treats it as small, optional, or trivial, or whether it is a case of comfortable traditions crowding out what the Bible overwhelmingly, clearly, consistently, unambiguously, unanimously commands.

Please consider the witness of history: the bloody epoch of church leaders persecuting each other over doctrinal differences ended, in all Christian churches around the world, largely through the example of a single church that set the tone for America: the Separatists, popularly known as the Pilgrims, who came to Plimoth, Massachusetts, in 1620. (Spelled “Plymouth” today.) (See my documentary “1620: When Freedom was Reborn”)

Their European pastor, John Robinson, left behind 1,000 pages of Bible study explaining the Scriptures from which they recreated Freedom of Speech, Religion, a vote for every man, and many other wonderful rights we take for granted today – rights not found among their Puritan neighbors who arrived in 1630, or their Church of England neighbors in Jamestown.

Isn’t a “worship service” the central activity of “church”, whose existence is evidence of the presence of a “church”? Are not, therefore, God’s instructions how to conduct it, fundamentally important?

Therefore is it not critical to know if God defines a worship service as consisting of dynamic verbal interaction allowed between all members, as the Separatists insisted, or as today’s worship services consisting of a lecture from a single man which is not to be interrupted, with all other messages pre-approved by that same man?

And today we see our nation about to crumble under the weight of its debt. We see only one solution, with a six week deadline, which requires prying the bushel of intra-member censorship off Christian Light, in a hurry. It is obvious to Christians familiar with how politics works – activists – that just a little tiny bit of that Separatist Freedom of Speech would quickly turn America’s government back to God. History shows us that this Christian communication which would save our Freedoms now, is what recreated our Freedoms from particular Scriptures in the first place.

I submit that this is not a Biblically trivial, vague, questionable, or even seriously arguable matter. It is clear, and urgent.

So let me assume, for argument’s sake, that preserving the freedoms recreated from Scripture four centuries ago requires American churches to obey the same Scriptures whose obedience recreated those freedoms then, and we have to accomplish this in six weeks. Besides . What then? Is that all we have to change?

I wish!

That would make everything so much simpler, if everything were all up to The Other Guy.

But unfortunately, this information is all about YOU.

Our Only National Debt Solution, Step One.

We have come to the beginning of the five-step program for saving America from its overwhelming debt with our only national debt solution, which just happens to equal our only immigration solution.

YOU are where it all begins. What will YOU do with this information?

After America flushes down the debt toilet we can all sit around a campfire and commiserate about what The Other Guy didn’t do, but God is taking notes on what YOU and I didn’t do. As Ezekiel 3:18-20, God will judge you for what you do.

You can pick apart my warning. You can find all the theological flaws in it. And if you spot some, you can contact me to help me purify them, or you can just ignore them entirely as if there is no merit in any of it. But God knows, according to Proverbs 24:10-12, whether your criticism or rejection is motivated by valid commitment to obeying God correctly or the desire to escape responsibility to act.

Should you decide to act, your task will not be easy. God’s people are almost as resistant to correction as God’s self-identified enemies. It will require all the creativity, intelligence, and talent you can muster, to penetrate their hard hearts.

Of course, we don’t want to discuss MY responsibility in all this. Am I as open to challenge as I plead with YOU to be? I may not be the best judge of that, but you can find out. Here is my contact information so you can call me or write me with any corrections, criticism, questions, or challenges:
Dave Leach, 515-244-3711 (work), HispanicHope@Saltshaker.US.

But, you wonder, will God judge people for not heeding a warning they never received? How will this warning, in this article, ever reach even a fraction of the church members, pastors, activists, and Congressmen it needs to reach, in order to show them God’s solution, and warn them of the consequences of refusing it? Luke 12:47-48 says people who were never told what God wanted them to do will be judged much less than those who knew and disobeyed. So won’t the impossibility of getting this message out that far and wide render God’s judgment moot?

If God’s solution is rejected again during these coming two months, I have no idea how many future chances God will give our nation after that. I know that in Jeremiah, as the Babylonian invaders were on their way, there were a series of chances God gave the people, if they would just obey God this time. But with each successive rejection of God, the deliverance God offered next was less than what was offered before.

I am not the only one who has seen these facts.

What I have written about the benefits of massive new immigration is common knowledge to economists. These economists write articles in mass media, so anyone who takes a hard immigration restrictionist line that ignores them is ignorant by choice.

What I have written about church censorship of information about Satan’s attacks through political forums is common knowledge to Christian activists. Activists continually struggle to find creative new ways to pry the Noninvolvement Bushel off the Churchlight. Pastors and church boards continually reach up and batten the bushel securely back down over their heads.

Democrats face judgment over abortion, sodomy, suppressing Christian Freedom of Speech, and several other offenses. Republicans face judgment over immigration. Churches, their pastors, and their members face judgment over hiding their light from their nation stumbling to its destruction in the darkness.

God predicts that a church’s purposes will probably not be established when it censors its potential for a “multitude of counselors” by allowing only one person to do all the counseling. At the least, this verse informs us that to have hope of its purposes being established, a church will need to aim a lot lower:

Proverbs 11:14 Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety. 15:22 Without counsel purposes are disappointed: but in the multitude of counsellors they are established. 24:6 For by wise counsel thou shalt make thy war: and in multitude of counsellors there is safety.

America has declined because Christians have not taken the leadership in ensuring that “in all [America’s] ways” we “acknowledge Him”, so we have thrown away His offer that “he shall direct thy paths.” Proverbs 3:6.

As Christian watchmen have ceased watching, acknowledgment of the relevance of God’s Word has been taken out of politics, schools, workplaces, and even out of the “busy” day-to-day lives of our Christian families.

Many say we shouldn’t worry about being involved because the Bible predicts things will only get worse and worse anyway. But where does the Bible tell us to volunteer to be the cause of it? Or to just sit down and wait for it? What happened to “occupy till I come”? Luke 19:13.

The Bible doesn’t even say “things will get worse and worse” everywhere, equally for all people, no matter how much they seek God, or that the “last days” are necessarily now.

True, “evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse”, 2 Timothy 3:13. But did you know “he that hath clean hands shall be stronger and stronger”, Job 17:9, “the path of the just…shineth more and more…”, Proverbs 4:18, “they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness…shall be filled”, Matthew 5:6, “he that is righteous” shall “be righteous still”, Revelation 22:11, and “in the last days…your sons and your daughters shall prophesy…”?

Did you know that just before “the end”, “this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come”? Wouldn’t you rather be one of the preachers, rather than one of those preached to?

Why should Christians escape this judgment when the verse they continually quote, 2 Chronicles 7:14, says it is not what The Other Guy does that will determine America’s fate, but what “My people, who are called by My name” do? That starts with YOU. Why doesn’t that verse alert Christians who want to save America to be on the lookout for what they themselves are doing to invite God’s wrath – what ‘wicked ways’ to ‘turn from’, as 2 Chronicles 7:14 puts it?

God’s statement that it is what “my people, who are called by my name” do that counts, is another way of saying the wicked are not a serious obstacle to a nation’s hope. Why? Perhaps because to the extent God’s people conduct worship services as God asks, wickedness will die out, as 1 Corinthians 14:24 “revival” breaks out. What hope do Satan’s lies have, if Christian light decides to shine on them?

I have presented these Scriptures to hundreds of pastors and thousands of laymen over the past 20 years. I respect someone who rejects my warning because they find some theological error in it. I wish those who say they disagree would spar with me a little longer before they drop out of the ring. But almost all the reaction I get is not alleged theological disagreement, but resolve not to allow the dialog modeled in Scripture regardless of what God says about it. In fact many pastors have confessed they agree with me about what God tells them to do, but they still won’t do it because, they say, their congregation won’t permit it, or they feel their current worship services give them as much blessing as they desire, or they just don’t see why it should be so important to God.

It is because Christians have not recreated the laboratory of relationship skills which was God’s Original Church, that our nation and our families are so divided. If this warning is heeded, much more than national debt and immigration policy will be healed, because this warning cannot, will not be heeded in the absence of a return to God by “My people, who are called by My Name”.

Which, I pray, includes YOU. I would really welcome your fellowship on this front.

May this be.

#### by Dave Leach 515/244-3711 (work)  HispanicHope (at) Saltshaker.US

Discuss: “National Debt Solution Part 5, Talking in Church”

  1. January 10, 2013 at 5:20 pm #

    Its Ol’ Dave the L – again Preachin’ with Chapter and Verse on this Blog Space – which is your right – BUT – WHICH IS NOT SANCTIONED for the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space !!!!!

    I guess that you enjoy Preachin’, Dave, WITHOUT SANCTION – which again is your right – PARTICULARLY – SINCE YOU, Dave, have the Right AND the Power – to START threads on the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space.

    I personally see you, Dave, as abusing the Right and the Power to START threads on the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space!!!! Obviously, Dave, this is my personal opinion – so take it as such. There are a number of us folk who regularly comment on a great number of threads within the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space – who Neither have the RIGHT or the POWER to START threads on this Blog Space.

    YOU, Dave – DO have the Right and the Power to start threads on this Blog Space – AND, Dave – YOU use this Right and this Power – to Preach – Chapter and Verse – on Theism – when you start a large number of threads on the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space.

    JUST reportin’ on a NON-equal right and power issue,

    Robert Allen

    Posted by boba123
  2. January 11, 2013 at 11:28 am #

    Robert, you have uncovered the ugly truth about me: I am power hungry! I am so covetous of my power to wash your atheist brain that I write even without your sanction! And thanks to you, the world now knows my sordid dark secret: I am a Christian. And not the quiet, politically correct, light-under-a-bushel, never-offend-anybody kind, but the kind who will happily abuse my right and power to post threads on the cafe con leche Republicans website, and anywhere else I can, to wash every atheist brain in the country if possible, without regard to whether it is popular, politically correct, or even legal, to WITNESS! Yes, that’s right, even if it were a crime to even mention the blessed name of Jesus Christ, and the penalty were torture, I would persist, shamelessly lawless to my last breath!
    That is what it means to be a Christian, according to the Bible and the examples of martyrs, prophets, and Jesus: to live and act without regard for any law, by any authority, that punishes what any regime considers offensive, without regarding as a defense any evidence that it is true.
    In the same spirit with all speech-suppressing tyrants of human history, you would ban me, if you have the power, not for anything you can identify in anything I have written that is untrue, but only for statements which, to you, are unwelcome. Because you are an atheist, and that is what atheists do.
    As for all those other sites you want me to run off to, will you promise to follow me there? Because so far, I have never yet experienced so faithful a comment-leaver after my articles as you! And you want me to voluntarily give up that fulfilling experience? You surely must know it is the dream of every Christian to get the attention of the most hopeless atheist he can find, and you have given me that blessing! I grant you the freedom not to even read my articles, yet like an iron filing to a magnet, like a moth to light, you are drawn despite all your resistance to Truth
    Actually I probably shouldn’t flatter myself that you have read any of my articles. Your comments don’t indicate that you do any more than do a word search through Cafe Con Leche Republicans articles for “God” or “Jesus”, and go marching off for the kill when you find it. Otherwise I wouldn’t think you would complain of the lack of “secular content” in my articles, which there was plenty of in these. But perhaps in your atheist mind any mention of God cancels any secular evidence or reasoning.
    But of all the words in my articles, you have read the two that are most important, and I praise God for that.
    Should you decide at some point to read the rest of my articles beyond those two words, you will discover that my strategy goes even beyond reaching you, to shining light on all the darkness in America which has brought her to her economic knees. Unopposed atheism, courtesy of pastors pulling their bushels of noninvolvement theologies snugly over their churchlight, have created the vacuum of truth and intelligence that has allowed atheists to successfully attack and tear the fabric of America. We are at a historical turning point where if this continues, freedom of speech is only the first of our freedoms which we will lose.
    Why would I want to write for any other blog, when it is this blog where I can talk with you? Where I can get a genuine atheist to read the word “God” every time I write it?
    I hereby dedicate all the articles I have written on this blog to my favorite (and only) comment-leaver: Robert Allen!
    Thank you, thank you, thank you!

    Posted by dleach
    • January 11, 2013 at 4:29 pm #

      So, Dave – Since you have the RIGHT and the POWER to START Threads on the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space – you ALSO exercice your right to rant about my simple objection that you, Dave, appear to be ABUSING your RIGHT and POWER, within an oligarchical-like monopoly of folk – to Cite Chapter and Verse of your Theism.

      ALL I’m doing, Dave, is Objecting to your oligarchical-like monopoly to start threads, citing Chapter and Verse of your Theism – on the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space.

      Pressin’ for a curtailment of your Abuse of Power, Dave,

      Robert Allen

      Posted by boba123
  3. February 3, 2013 at 5:20 pm #

    Ah Shucks, Dave – still AVOIDING a conversation, I see !!!!!!

    Posted by boba123
  4. February 18, 2013 at 10:42 pm #

    Double DOG Shucks, Dave – STILL AVOIDING a conversation – about what I perceive as an abuse of your power !!!!!!

    Just Commentin’ – AGAIN – and again,

    Robert Allen

    Posted by boba123
  5. February 18, 2013 at 10:49 pm #

    I betch, Dave – that not ONLY am I your most NON-Theistic Faithful Fan (NFF) – but that I’ve more than doubled ALL of the comments that you have received within this Blog Space.

    You SHOULD be proud, Dave – that you have SUCH a LOYAL NFF !!!!!

    Your Loyal NFF,

    Robert Allen

    Posted by boba123
  6. February 19, 2013 at 10:54 am #

    Robert, I am absolutely thrilled that you have blessed me with comments, at least comments up to the standards of a web counter. As for “conversation” with you, as much as I look forward to that day, so far that dream has been elusive. When I respond thoroughly to your bubbly barbs, and then you keep on bubbling without responding to anything I wrote to let me know how it fails to satisfy you or if you even read it, is that how you define “conversation”? I suppose I could just repeat all the things I already said, like you do, but actually I’m kind of busy right now with a tuba repair.

    Posted by biblewizard
    • February 19, 2013 at 11:10 am #

      So, Dave – WHEN are you ready to speak with me about what I perceive as you abusing the power that you have with the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space – of PREACHING your Christian Theism – when you know FULL WELL from Bob Quasius – that the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space Neither sanctions nor condones your PREACHING of your Christian Theism ???

      Just askin’,

      Robert Allen

      Posted by boba123
  7. February 19, 2013 at 11:34 am #

    Asked and answered, as they say in court. But keep on repeating. I need the traffic.

    Posted by biblewizard
    • February 19, 2013 at 12:32 pm #

      Ah, Dave – I DON’T see you answering the question – of you abusing the power to start threads within the Cafe Con Leche Republicans Blog Space!!!!

      WHY, Dave – do you – and do you want to – ABUSE Power ?????

      Just askin’,

      Robert Allen

      Posted by boba123

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